How to get realistic and significant turb in clouds & severe turb in TS

L

lkn

Member
Hi @damian

After more than a year that I stopped flying msfs because of unrealistic weather system and missing realistic features regarding bad weather conditions, but recently I decided to give a try with the last AS update and SU4 msfs 2024.
I had hopes and trust that there will be a change in terms of realism and that msfs will be close to Xplane by flying in bad weather conditions especially TS where we encounter severe icing conditions, drastic up&downdraft and so on... (I know: big hopes near to utopia based and I sould have read forums before! lol)

Unfortunately I realize that I was wrong, I've tried the combo AS/Real Turb all settings possible, it doesn't add that much at all, I can still fly a C152 in CB without any realistic turbulence like in Xplane and more like in real life where you definitely don't want to fly a C172 in CB so what about TS??? Nothing happens even if rarely msfs depicts TS! So even if you check "REALISTIC THUNDERSTORM UP AND DOWNDRAFT" AS option, it adds anything that really matters at all!!! (as it was mentioned on forums by the way)

So what this option does change? I have no idea but nothing at the end of the day which is a shame. I bought AS (I'm an old client) for that purpose, and the fact that you guys the devs, gives and gave so much to add realism and joy in our flight sim since years, of course that I can't and I don't want to blame you in anyways.
At the first place I know that Asabo didn't translate its promises into actions since 2020 as a matter of fact however why AS "made me" believe that using this option will make a change in this precious aera ? Same concerning "realistic" turb in clouds with RealTurb, it adds a little but nothing very significant at all and same for with only AS/MSFS or even the combo AS/MSFS/REALTURB we see a tiny difference but it doesn't add anything about realism and especially the danger in the skies, nothing.

I'd like to get some explanation about that please. Also is there anything you technically can do to make it happen? Means severe turb in TS or/and CB, is it possible to add "Danger in the Skies" based on the severe weather conditions of the day? That really matters IMO for the sake of realism!

Thank you and Regards

Lkn
 
damian

damian

Developer
Staff member
Have you increase your turbulence scale and other turb options to max in ASFS and still not getting enough (it should be uncontrollable)? If so, please give an example date/time/location so I can try to recreate. Also please do try without Real Turb, as this may interfere (we test and tune based on Low turb setting in MSFS and no other add-ons outside of ASFS).
 
L

lkn

Member
Hi Damian,

Tks for your reply. After digging for informations on forums and based on what it was said in return and based on my own experience, there is definitely no way to have realistic TS and its danger in skies in msfs, of course that I've done all tests possible and settings possible with AS, without AS, with AS/RT etc, 100% turbulence scale etc, around the world, it doesn't work at all. The CB/TS are definitely too casual!

Users say the same as I do (we are a niche so the realism is not that important for Asobo) , it feels that AS cannot do a thing to make a change because of the limitations of Asobo/msfs, it's just cosmetic, sure that I have turbulence relief, alterities, even people complain that it is too strong because they never fly above mountains for instance but this sort of turb have nothing to do with my request, there are several posts about that topic on msfs forum as "no turbulence in clouds" "no danger in skies" "add up-downdraft" etc something like that but easy to find out, the users use AS as well but no matter the location where METAR indicate TS or CB, it is just cosmetic since 2020 with or without AS, it doesn't change a thing even if it seems that AS add some turb but it has nothing do with severe turbulence in TS. It is so easy to reproduce, just check the METAR and take off from that place with severe weather conditions of the day and you will have the same verdict : cosmetic! ;-)

The fact is that you can fly a Cub in TS active sky activated no matter the mode used, it doesn't add any danger in the skies under unsafe flight conditions, also you can even fly in severe icing conditions it remains in arcade mode, it doesn't impact the envelop of the aircraft, the speed, only some addons like the A2A seem to respond to icing conditions but again it is very limited, Imade 3 flight A2 Comanche/Aerostar in very unsafe icing weather, in Xplane I stall and crashed as expected, in msfs I can still fly without any worries because of msfs limitations (again) Asobo do not care about realistic icing conditions... all is just cosmetic and definitely unrealistic compared to Xplane and the RL.

There is no single user who has encounter severe lethal turb in TS so far in msfs 2020/2024 it's not a bug, it is just impossible due to the limitations of Asobo no matter if you use AS, RT etc it add just a little in order to ??? I don't know...

To make my test: there is no other plug like XP realistic, trying all the settings possible in msfs and active sky, again please give a try in TS you'll see it doesn't work and I believe that you already know it, it can't be ignored, but again we are a niche so that people won't complain about except that our old topic is now under investigation since 3 years after getting many votes, but the majority complain if an updraft goes above 1000 ft, knowing that in TS it can reach +- 8000 ft and more sometimes and icing etc and so on...

This is the reason why I asked if there is some future about it with AS ?
 
Daveo

Daveo

Community Manager
Staff member
What/which aircraft are you using? I am getting bounced around all over the place here.
 
damian

damian

Developer
Staff member
I already know it? I can’t replicate problems with aircraft not becoming occasionally uncontrollable at max turb scale. I do notice a difference in the latest SU4beta where it does seem noticeably subdued compared to previous version(s). We're working on tuning for SU4 - but most of this will occur after SU4 release where we have an official/stable/unchanging build. We're also working to restore some of the wind/draft effect severity that recent builds have reduced or eliminated in many cases. As I am tuning with SU4 official, I will make it a point to provide "unsurvivable" levels of effects (those who would use this represent a very tiny fraction of our user base lately, but I like the idea).
 
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L

lkn

Member
@damian @Daveo Hi Captains,

What I mean by "I guess you already know it" is that it is known that we don't have any "danger in the skies" in msfs 2020/2024 no severe turb in TS, this is my only topic here so that I believe it is easy to reproduce, just fly in TS and there is no way to get "flip flop" the bird due to drastic and lethal turbulence like we have by using Xplane/Active Sky even XP by itself (less than with AS so thank you for that!)

If it was the case that we have dangerous CB and TS then we will be all happy (i mean those like myself who opened like 3 or 4 threads in this area on fs forums, "dangerous skies" "add turb in CB" "realitis icing") I'm not sure if it is exactly written this way but by all means there is no way to get dangerous turb in CB in TS neither flying msfs.

@Daveo your airplane got bounced, same here, many times by the way, I'm not talking about turb in general, so you are right there is some turb here and there but my point is just about "danger in the skies", if you find a TS (if you are lucky that msfs SU4 beta depicts one then you'll see that your Cub, your PMDG 737, your Felix A320 no matter the aircraft you fly it doesn't change the fact that you can still fly in TS without severe up/dowdraft, severe unsafe turbulence, severe icing conditions and so on that make TS unsafe for flight like in Xplane, like in the real world. Sincerely you can reproduce that.

What I also mean is that : since centuries (lol) it is "under investigation" by Asobo but I just thought that by using AS it will make a change, I know it is not your fault, I'm not an expert in API but the blame goes to Asobo who closed the doors to the devs to investigate in order to enhance this precious area for the sake of realism means the LIVE WEATHER AND ITS DANGERS IN THE SKIES! (sure in advertisings they claim we have phenoma, storms, and so on, but it is just advertisings, video expo 2023 like an user posted to show the differences between promises and reality concerning the real live weather)

Anyway, no matter if you use active sky/real turb it won't make a change, just it add some turb no doubt but what can of specific turb in CB/TS, that is the story about. In other words you don't even need to create a flight plan based on the weather conditions of the day because it's not going to make your flight unsafe based on METAR/TAF because msfs do not simulated any unsafe weather through severe icing conditions, TS/CB, no need to do a FP based on the weather, as we do in real life or at least in Xplane, you really don't want to fly a C172 in CB, I'm not even talking about TS now just CB.

Really guys, it is easy to reproduce it, forget TS, just CB and fly a Cub, you may get turbulence moderate maybe random strong ones but you still can fly without any severe consequences at all.

I know, we all know that you do your best to add realism and you did and you will but when we can't we just can't not because of your creativity and duties that you play so well since years for the sake of our joy, for that my big respect, my guess if that you can't because of Asobo don't open the doors to the devs (API), as I've read, as I do believe.

Regards
 
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damian

damian

Developer
Staff member
Thanks for the feedback and clarification. As mentioned I'm working on this. I'm thinking an "Extreme Thunderstorm Effects" mode which will replace the current "realistic updrafts/downdrafts in Tstorms" option, and when flying in-cloud in such CB formations, you really won't be able to control the airplane at all in smaller aircraft (and airframe will overstress accordingly if you've got that realism option set). In larger aircraft extreme turbulence will also be increased. Thus you'll get the real danger you are after. As also mentioned, most users will not like this at all, but it is realistic, and will be available for those who want it.
 
L

lkn

Member
@damian you just make my day! Reading this "Extreme Thunderstorm Effects" & "realistic updrafts/downdrafts in Tstorms" option, and when flying in-cloud in such CB formations you really won't be able to control the airplane at all in smaller aircraft (and airframe will overstress accordingly if you've got that realism option set)". Sure that some casual users won't like it, I respect that, some of them do like flying without any turb, even some RL pilots collegues, it's ok, they will have the choice between casual flights and realistic ones at least, however you will bring such a big time respect to the realism and especially to the users like myself who really really want that option! Captain @damian trust me that will be a game changer, many of us are waiting for that, we reach around 800 votes if it's not even more now (I have to check it out) Would like to allow me to share this precious information or it may be wise to wait ?

I'm so happy to hear that anyways, you're the best guys in this area and you will remain it! Thank you for the love you put in your great work for us!
 
K

Khusta

New member
damian said:
Thanks for the feedback and clarification. As mentioned I'm working on this. I'm thinking an "Extreme Thunderstorm Effects" mode which will replace the current "realistic updrafts/downdrafts in Tstorms" option, and when flying in-cloud in such CB formations, you really won't be able to control the airplane at all in smaller aircraft (and airframe will overstress accordingly if you've got that realism option set). In larger aircraft extreme turbulence will also be increased. Thus you'll get the real danger you are after. As also mentioned, most users will not like this at all, but it is realistic, and will be available for those who want it.
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Any update on this? Im looking forward to it.
 
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